hi

We all know that all clinics only display the BEST results that they have, they are not just average and random results like they would like you to believe..so that leads me to my next point and question
...what happens in case of bad/failed HT?

Even if you go to top sugeon there is still a chance of poor yield, the best docs out there have a bad day or simply for whatever reason result dont turn right, ALL docs have sceletons in their closet that they dont wanna talk abt, i dont think they have 100% success 100% of time.

In this hypothetical scenario lets say you end up going to the one of the very best surgeons in the world(IAHRS, Coalition member,etc) and results turn bad,with only 50% of transplanted hair growing which can easyly be proven by before and after photos...

So what will happen next? What option does the patient have?
Would you get refund or part of it OR would you get more grafts for free or cheaper rate?
Are you allowed to name and shame the doc in public forums?
When i say name and shame I mean putting before/after pictures on the forums and state the name of the HT doc who performed HT and let public be the judge and jury?

I wanna know how clinics deal with these sorts of patients, its important IMO.

Feel free to comment


Didi




Edited: 12/02/2011 at 06:10 PM by didi

First of all a IAHRS OR COALITON member means nothing!! It only means they pay their yearly dues to a pestigious sounding organization. I chose a doctor from their list and my results were terrible. You need to be very clear up front with a doctor about what happens if you have little to no growth after a HT. Ask them if they refund zero growth and are they willing to put it in writing. If the doctor gets angry with any questions RUN!

If they say they will give you another surgery free RUN! If they already did one failed surgery on you dont let them butcher you again. The doctor can not take away your freedoms to tell you experience with them online. They may threaten to sue but its only a threat. Yea i know from experience!!

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3 strip surgeries from 1994 to 1999 Dr carl shory with terrible pluggy results$9000

2002 another pluggy strip sugery Dr lawrence shapiro$3000

Went to alan bauman in 2005 for repair work from prior surgeries. He made things much worse with more scarring and no results from 3 strips 2005 to 2008.$21000

Not every doc can get into these 2 organizations even if they wanna pay membership fee.

Shapiro and Bauman have good reputation and they are members of these 2 clubs.


I think even the best docs out there screw up sometimes. thats the reality.


Question is how they deal with it?

I think refund would be fair as havin another surgery with someone who screwed up in the first place is not appealing


anyone ever got any money back from clinic?

shapiro and bauman have good reps? You sir need to do alot more research!!!

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3 strip surgeries from 1994 to 1999 Dr carl shory with terrible pluggy results$9000

2002 another pluggy strip sugery Dr lawrence shapiro$3000

Went to alan bauman in 2005 for repair work from prior surgeries. He made things much worse with more scarring and no results from 3 strips 2005 to 2008.$21000

even good docs have bad results and also bad docs can get great result

Who in your opinion would be doc that consistently gets good to great results...
i dont think there is one out there...it is kinda gamble

some are better than others , results we see on their websites are cherry picked..n i mean cherry picked

the best way to look for good surgeon it to look for complaints and bad results he had and how often he screws up....its a bit hard as many patients with poor HT dont go public and dont want to further humiliate themselves

Didi it takes a long time to make a good choice. It does help to speak to as many patients as possible both happy and unhappy. Have as many consults as possible as a way of learning about the industry. Try your best to speak with people that work in the industry or who have worked in the industry that is like striking gold when you make those contacts. Read the forums and ask lots of questions and judge not only the content of the responses but the tone.

When using the forums it can take years to get a very clear picture of who all the players are and where they fit into the picture. Lots of money being made and they don't take too kindly to anyone stepping on their toes. Watch for personal attacks as it happens for a reason, much easier than just answering questions. Watch for posters that try persuade others to leave the forums. Ask yourself why would this happen if that poster brings something of value to the board? Watch for posters that seem to be very vocal touting how they will soon be showing their results but boom they disappear. When using the forums alone it takes at least 5 years of constant observation to get the big picture or alternatively go through every post over the last 5 years. Many often miss the really valuable posts as they just were not in the right place at the right time.

In the mean time keep asking questions of the clinics and doctors. When those responses go unanswered or are that of a crazed jackal maybe you hit a nerve and that question needs further investigation.

BTW you did make this comment which does seem odd to me seeing that you are researching and only have 8 posts to date. It is not an attack but simply a question that only requires a simple response. Much like the questions you should be asking others.

Thats the reason why Woods patients look very thin, they run out of $$$

Why would you make such a statement after only consulting with a clinic and seeming relatively new to the forums. It's like insulting someone you just met it doesn't seem like a normal response to me.

These are exactly the type of statements to investigate further when researching.

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Stay away from doctors who perform mega sessions, have posts deleted, attack posters, sue patients & forum owners, use power drills or robots. I recommend fue with hand punches in the .70-.85 range. I consulted with dozens of clinics over the years and there was a recurring theme regarding FUE among some employees of those other clinics. I was told Bisanga was the man my research told me the same and my experience validated my own research.

Edited: 12/04/2011 at 06:52 AM by topcat

Chonger I don't want to take the thread off topic but I would say that body and beard hair is probably best reserved for repair patients and those that can mix in some scalp hair. An all body/beard hair transplant on a very high norwood usually does not look natural. I think ethical clinics take it slow and make sure the patient understands the procedure showing them both good and not so good results.

Some cases that I have seen in general I would not have performed if I was in this business. Virgin heads using only body and beard hair are almost always a bad idea. If it is an extensively scarred patient and it improves their situation while not being 100% perfect than you need to weigh the benefits.


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Stay away from doctors who perform mega sessions, have posts deleted, attack posters, sue patients & forum owners, use power drills or robots. I recommend fue with hand punches in the .70-.85 range. I consulted with dozens of clinics over the years and there was a recurring theme regarding FUE among some employees of those other clinics. I was told Bisanga was the man my research told me the same and my experience validated my own research.

I think the results posted to forums by patients are just as good as the cases that HT surgeons choose to post to the forums or display on their websites. Of course they won't choose to post a result that doesn't turn out well, (would anyone expect them to?) but patients are free to share their experiences whether good or bad.

Some surgeons will have guarantees. For example, I'll quote from Dr Rahal's website:

"For every hair restoration procedure performed at Rahal, we guarantee to replace any non-growing hair transplant graft free of charge. In our experience, such replacement is rarely necessary."

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I represent Dr Rahal and can be contacted for consultations and advice.

My email.

Dr Rahal's website.

That is a very interesting guarantee, how do we know how many grafts grow?
do we know if there are 3800 or 4000 grafts growing, no way to tell that so guarantee makes no sense if you ask me.

I disagree that results posted by patients are as good as results posted by clinics simply bc clinics cherry pick the best of the best.

I would agree with didi here.

It's only patients that post the sh*t results and not the clinics. When those same patients post their sh*t results they are often hounded off the forums.

I have also seen plenty of results posted to the forums by patients over the years that would be considered very poor outcomes. So yes in fact they would post those results. But then again many just choose to disappear.

The fact is that on some forums patients are not allowed to share their experience good or bad.

I was in fact banned from one forum because I spoke too highly of my own fue experience. I was considered persona non grata and told I was dangerous. Let's be real mattj.


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Stay away from doctors who perform mega sessions, have posts deleted, attack posters, sue patients & forum owners, use power drills or robots. I recommend fue with hand punches in the .70-.85 range. I consulted with dozens of clinics over the years and there was a recurring theme regarding FUE among some employees of those other clinics. I was told Bisanga was the man my research told me the same and my experience validated my own research.

topcat

I think the ones that post bad results dont disappear from forums but are often banned . I was banned from a forum for posting negative on bauman and have been warned by others to back off or be banned!! They say they have to be fair to doctors that butcher patients and take us for thousands of dollars!

The bottom line is that if a doctor is recommmended on a forum and a patient post negative on the doctor he will usually be banned!!

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3 strip surgeries from 1994 to 1999 Dr carl shory with terrible pluggy results$9000

2002 another pluggy strip sugery Dr lawrence shapiro$3000

Went to alan bauman in 2005 for repair work from prior surgeries. He made things much worse with more scarring and no results from 3 strips 2005 to 2008.$21000

Did you write to Spencer Kobren from baldtruth abt your experience with these docs that he recomends but u ended up worse...


what if you go to his forum and tell em abt yr results, would you get banned?

Didi I do not believe any of the doctors that worked on me in the past are on that list as the list did not even exist. My experience goes back much farther than any forum by at least 10 years. I have posted my experience on that forum and it's not a problem.

I will say that there are some doctors on that list and other lists that have many complaints because I have personally spoken to those patients. Picking a doctor off a list in my opinion is a very bad idea sure it might be easy but it's not a substitute for one's own research which takes at least a few years. Unfortunately when one is being paid to be on a list it does become a conflict of interest regardless of the intentions.

I have found that particular forum to be fair and open to the views of the patients and not a cheerleading site for clinics only.

I would also add this forum HLH is one of only a few that is credible, honest and very well moderated. All one needs to do is search the history and read some of the responses from the moderator. One can only conclude regardless of if you agree with his views or not that he is extremely honest and a person of integrity.

Didi, btw the statement you made about that specific person and forum is very reckless. Check your facts beforehand. I have never implied in any posting ever that I had work done by doctors on that list. You really should be a bit more careful in what you post.

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Stay away from doctors who perform mega sessions, have posts deleted, attack posters, sue patients & forum owners, use power drills or robots. I recommend fue with hand punches in the .70-.85 range. I consulted with dozens of clinics over the years and there was a recurring theme regarding FUE among some employees of those other clinics. I was told Bisanga was the man my research told me the same and my experience validated my own research.

Edited: 12/06/2011 at 07:25 PM by topcat