hair loss help.com is your complete hair loss guide and resource for info about Propecia, Rogaine, minoxidil, transplants, thymuskin, Revivogen, folliguard, tricomin and other hair loss and baldness remedies
Hair Loss Help
Decrease font size
Increase font size
Topic Title: Minoxidil not working?
Topic Summary:
Created On: 01/21/2011 05:15 PM
Status: Post and Reply
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch
1 2 Next Last unread
Search Topic Search Topic
Topic Tools Topic Tools
View similar topics View similar topics
View topic in raw text format. Print this topic.
 01/21/2011 05:15 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
dh05
Occasional Poster

Posts: 25
Joined: 01/21/2011

Hi, I'm 27 - not yet bald but receding and as I originally had very thin hair anyway it shows. I'd rather shave it off than be receding because I hate looking at it every time I'm in front of a mirror, tracking the process as it happens. That is what I've done but I know I looked MUCH better (actually fairly good looking) when I had a full hairline.

I've been using minoxidil 2.5% for the last 9 months and I have no idea if its worked. I certainly haven't gained any hair and it has got worse but I'll never know if it would have got worse quicker without it. I stayed away from the 5% because I wanted a back up plan but I'm not convinced 5% will make any difference - does it even work on temples (I've heard not) ????

What else can I do? - I really don't want to take any internal medicines like propecia as messing with my hormones is a risk I don't want to take - I've heard so many horror stories and as someone who enjoys sport I want to be in good shape and fear propecia could affect that.

Hair Transplant is out of the question for now - no way I could afford it. If i were to be able to afford it in future then it would have to be something which left no scar as I hate the thought of being even more scared of being bald. The fue looks ok for this but apparently its not as effective as strip? I don't think a HT would work for me as like I said my hair is naturally thin/soft so I'd need to replace a lot of hair per area.

Anyone got any tips/suggestions?

cheers









 01/22/2011 08:32 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
dh05
Occasional Poster

Posts: 25
Joined: 01/21/2011

nobody??
 01/22/2011 08:45 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
MajmX
Regular Poster

Posts: 92
Joined: 07/13/2005

You might add Nizoral 2% twice a week to your recipe. It should work almost as well as 2% minox according to one study.
 01/22/2011 08:55 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
csmike
Regular Poster

Posts: 116
Joined: 07/20/2010

an ht is not expensive, thats a common misconception, if most people can afford buying $25k cars, why not a $15k transplant? say its a $15K procedure, being 27 i assume you should have enough to put $3000 down, now you have to pay $12k

financing a $12k loan over 5 years or so at a reasonable interest rate should result in about a $250-$300/month for five years, quite affordable, also because ur 27 i assume you should be a bit ahead in your career so your salary should be between $50k-$60k a year so you can definitely afford the ht
 01/22/2011 09:07 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
RSR38
Prolific Poster

Posts: 386
Joined: 05/12/2010

Those are some pretty big assumptions. Maybe you could do his taxes for him without even seeing his W2...LOL
 01/22/2011 09:59 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
blankall
Prolific Poster

Posts: 212
Joined: 08/23/2010

haha you'd be surprised how many 27 year olds aren't as ahead in their careers as you think. Especially if he went to college. Not only would that set him many years back as he would be in school instead of the workforce but he might have huge debts from it.
 01/22/2011 10:33 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
dh05
Occasional Poster

Posts: 25
Joined: 01/21/2011

According to one study?? Do people actually have good results with it alone and how does it work? From what I read it is for use in combating dandruff and not medically accepted as a treatment for hair loss.
 01/22/2011 10:36 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
dh05
Occasional Poster

Posts: 25
Joined: 01/21/2011

Originally posted by: csmike

an ht is not expensive, thats a common misconception, if most people can afford buying $25k cars, why not a $15k transplant? say its a $15K procedure, being 27 i assume you should have enough to put $3000 down, now you have to pay $12k



financing a $12k loan over 5 years or so at a reasonable interest rate should result in about a $250-$300/month for five years, quite affordable, also because ur 27 i assume you should be a bit ahead in your career so your salary should be between $50k-$60k a year so you can definitely afford the ht


Do you always make such big assumptions?

I could afford it if I really saved however when I have other big costs e.g. buying a house, it seems pretty stupid to spend all that money on something which quite possibly wont work anyway.

What are peoples experiences here of FUE hair transplant? I've heard so many stories of HT going wrong and scars being left so that they cant even shave their heads without people noticing.
 01/22/2011 10:47 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
DecadeTwo
Accomplished Poster

Posts: 6269
Joined: 06/13/2010

Originally posted by: dh05

According to one study?? Do people actually have good results with it alone and how does it work? From what I read it is for use in combating dandruff and not medically accepted as a treatment for hair loss.


According to many studies, he's absolutely correct.

The active ingredient in Nizoral Is Ketoconazole, which as well as being antifungal is antiandrogenic. Hair loss, known formally as ANDRO-Genetic Alopecia, is caused by androgens.

It's not very strong, though. If you don't want to consider finasteride then your only real options are topical antiandrogens such as Nizoral Shampoo and Spironolactone Cream. Unfortunately, I doubt you'll stick with that regimen for long.

One thing is for sure: if you have been on minoxidil for 9 months and aren't sure if it's working means that you aren't gonna get any great results from it. Because minoxidil does not interfere with the fundamental balding process (caused by androgens), people on minoxidil tend to experience a brief regrowth period within the first 5 months or so, and then continue to lose hair at the pre-treatment rate.



-------------------------
NW < 2 since 1999

The plural of 'anecdote' is not 'evidence'.
--Alan I. Leshner

Correlation does not imply causation.
--Logic

When you believe in things that you don't understand then you suffer. Superstition ain't the way.
--Stevie Wonder

I'm not an MD, and I'm not a hair loss expert.
 01/22/2011 11:19 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
majorsixth
Accomplished Poster

Posts: 2662
Joined: 04/05/2008



Yeah i agree that most people do experience results of some nature usually within a 4-5 months. However, i don't agree that the regrowth stops after a short period of time for everyone. I use minox and I'm still getting regrowth after 3 years.
 01/22/2011 11:20 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
csmike
Regular Poster

Posts: 116
Joined: 07/20/2010

Originally posted by: dh05

Do you always make such big assumptions?



I could afford it if I really saved however when I have other big costs e.g. buying a house, it seems pretty stupid to spend all that money on something which quite possibly wont work anyway.
.


Yeah I apologize for those assumptions, I was just trying to point out that HT's aren't as expensive as people make them out to be, especially since with the Big 3, you have to keep taking them for the rest of your life, so ultimately their costs will exceed that of the transplant. Also, fin has some sides that may put off a lot of people (gyno, sex side effects), and from what I heard, gyno can only be fixed via surgery.

The only problem I see with a HT is that if your hairloss goes beyond a NW6 or 7 and you may either run out of donor hair or need another HT.
 01/22/2011 01:16 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
dh05
Occasional Poster

Posts: 25
Joined: 01/21/2011

Originally posted by: csmike

Originally posted by: dh05



Do you always make such big assumptions?







I could afford it if I really saved however when I have other big costs e.g. buying a house, it seems pretty stupid to spend all that money on something which quite possibly wont work anyway.

.




Yeah I apologize for those assumptions, I was just trying to point out that HT's aren't as expensive as people make them out to be, especially since with the Big 3, you have to keep taking them for the rest of your life, so ultimately their costs will exceed that of the transplant. Also, fin has some sides that may put off a lot of people (gyno, sex side effects), and from what I heard, gyno can only be fixed via surgery.



The only problem I see with a HT is that if your hairloss goes beyond a NW6 or 7 and you may either run out of donor hair or need another HT.


no problem, i see your points. It is tempting but like I said I have no idea if scars would be left.

Also, say they transplant the receding parts now. What happens then when I eventually am completely bald? I'll have to keep paying for new transplants or risk looking stupid. If I do get to NW6 or 7 then I do risk running out of donor hair (particularly as my hair is naturally thin) and having a really stupid looking pattern on my head.

With the side effects from fin, there's no way I could consider it. I'd rather lose my hair than lose what makes me a man.

 01/22/2011 01:20 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
dh05
Occasional Poster

Posts: 25
Joined: 01/21/2011

Originally posted by: DecadeTwo

Originally posted by: dh05



According to one study?? Do people actually have good results with it alone and how does it work? From what I read it is for use in combating dandruff and not medically accepted as a treatment for hair loss.




According to many studies, he's absolutely correct.



The active ingredient in Nizoral Is Ketoconazole, which as well as being antifungal is antiandrogenic. Hair loss, known formally as ANDRO-Genetic Alopecia, is caused by androgens.



It's not very strong, though. If you don't want to consider finasteride then your only real options are topical antiandrogens such as Nizoral Shampoo and Spironolactone Cream. Unfortunately, I doubt you'll stick with that regimen for long.



One thing is for sure: if you have been on minoxidil for 9 months and aren't sure if it's working means that you aren't gonna get any great results from it. Because minoxidil does not interfere with the fundamental balding process (caused by androgens), people on minoxidil tend to experience a brief regrowth period within the first 5 months or so, and then continue to lose hair at the pre-treatment rate.


So basically, without finasteride there's not a lot of hope?

You say you doubt i'd continue with the topical shampoo/Spironolactone cream for long - is that because it's not likely to work well?

Also...how am I supposed to tell if the minoxidil is working? Could I not have lost hair at a faster rate without it? I don't think it has done much though - if it has kept any hair then it's only very fine straggly hair which doesn't look good anyway. On the other hand, that could just be hair which is on its way out. I guess it's not worth trying the 5%?



 01/22/2011 04:59 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
csmike
Regular Poster

Posts: 116
Joined: 07/20/2010

dh05 do you have any pics so we can assess your conditoin?
 01/22/2011 05:08 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
dh05
Occasional Poster

Posts: 25
Joined: 01/21/2011

http://tinypic.com/r/25kpgd5/7

I only have this shaved head pic on me. I don't know if this looks bad at all but because I have naturally thin hair the temples look very thin when it's long so I've been cutting it short (not usually as short as in the pic) although I've noticed a change in peoples perceptions of me when it is completely shaved - the crown isn't too bad when it's long but that could soon change.

 01/22/2011 05:21 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
HK
Prolific Poster

Posts: 234
Joined: 02/18/2010

Drop the 2% and try 5%. If that doesnt work go for the 15% or prox, but I would definitely consider getting on fin.

**Forgot to mention that I was also receding but I'm making decent progress at the hairline after only 2 and 1/2 months of 5% minox and 11 months on fin. It started with alot of shedding followed by little baby hairs where my hairline used to be and now theyre growing even thicker and longer. If it keeps up I will be back to what I was before I noticed hairloss. Also wanted to add that I have not stopped shedding, there are literally clumps of thick hair in my shower drain (the girlfriend even made a comment about it).
 01/22/2011 05:48 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
csmike
Regular Poster

Posts: 116
Joined: 07/20/2010

I can't see your face, but you don't look too shabby shaved bro.
 01/22/2011 07:18 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
DecadeTwo
Accomplished Poster

Posts: 6269
Joined: 06/13/2010

Originally posted by: dh05
So basically, without finasteride there's not a lot of hope?

You say you doubt i'd continue with the topical shampoo/Spironolactone cream for long - is that because it's not likely to work well?


I would say there's less hope. You can smear a bunch of topical antiandrogens on your scalp, and probably get results as good or better than finasteride. People in general may be willing to do that for a year or two, but what about for ten or fifteen?

Originally posted by: dh05
Also...how am I supposed to tell if the minoxidil is working? Could I not have lost hair at a faster rate without it? I don't think it has done much though - if it has kept any hair then it's only very fine straggly hair which doesn't look good anyway. On the other hand, that could just be hair which is on its way out. I guess it's not worth trying the 5%?


Chances are you would be at least a little worse off today had you never gotten on minoxidil, but if the results aren't obvious after 9 months, it's just not gonna get any better.

Ultimately, because minox does not interfere with the fundamental mechanism of AGA (that being androgens), people using minoxidil alone tend to lose hair at the same rate as people not using minoxidil. The difference is that the people on minoxidil usually have a bit more hair to work with.

Here is a graph from one of several placebo-controlled minoxidil hair count studies that illustrates the point.

As you can see, after what refer to as an "offset" of regrowth, the rate of hair loss remains unchanged.



Now compare the rate of continued hair loss to the placebo group in a finasteride study:



The difference is obvious.

-------------------------
NW < 2 since 1999

The plural of 'anecdote' is not 'evidence'.
--Alan I. Leshner

Correlation does not imply causation.
--Logic

When you believe in things that you don't understand then you suffer. Superstition ain't the way.
--Stevie Wonder

I'm not an MD, and I'm not a hair loss expert.
 01/22/2011 08:52 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Bryan
Accomplished Poster

Posts: 8410
Joined: 03/04/2001

Originally posted by: dh05

Also...how am I supposed to tell if the minoxidil is working? Could I not have lost hair at a faster rate without it? I don't think it has done much though - if it has kept any hair then it's only very fine straggly hair which doesn't look good anyway. On the other hand, that could just be hair which is on its way out. I guess it's not worth trying the 5%?


Trust me on this: if it's worth trying 2% Rogaine, it's worth trying 5% Rogaine! That's because the only thing that's important is the cost per milligram of minoxidil, and 5% solutions are almost certainly cheaper in that regard than 2% solutions. To get the same effect as applying 1 mL of 2%, simply apply 0.4 mL of 5%. It'll work the same, and be cheaper. To get a somewhat better effect, apply a full mL of the 5%.

By the way, I agree with DecadeTwo that it's not a good idea to use topical minoxidil alone as your sole treatment. It doesn't seem to interfere with the fundamental cause of balding, so your balding will very likely continue to progress at a similar rate on minoxidil alone. I very strongly advise you to use something else along with it.
 01/22/2011 09:38 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
freakout
Regular Poster

Posts: 107
Joined: 01/09/2011

thin hair all througout the scalp? and/or diffused?

Have yourself checked for low iron count.


-------------------------
My regimen:"Physiological Countermeasures" from the book "I Broke the Mystery of Male Pattern Baldness"
Hair Loss Help » Hair Loss Open Topic » Minoxidil not working?

1 2 Next Last unread
Topic Tools Topic Tools
Statistics
31659 users are registered to the Hair Loss Help forum.
There are currently 12 users logged in.
The most users ever online was 10152 on 02/16/2012 at 11:47 AM.
There are currently 545 guests browsing this forum, which makes a total of 557 users using this forum.

FuseTalk Basic Edition v3.2 - © 1999-2014 FuseTalk Inc. All rights reserved.

Copyright 2001-2012 - All Rights Reserved - Hairlosshelp, Inc