hair loss help.com is your complete hair loss guide and resource for info about Propecia, Rogaine, minoxidil, transplants, thymuskin, Revivogen, folliguard, tricomin and other hair loss and baldness remedies
Hair Loss Help
Decrease font size
Increase font size
Topic Title: Will stopping steroids stop hairloss??
Topic Summary:
Created On: 02/23/2010 06:08 PM
Status: Post and Reply
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch
1 2 3 4 5 Next Last unread
Search Topic Search Topic
Topic Tools Topic Tools
View similar topics View similar topics
View topic in raw text format. Print this topic.
 02/23/2010 06:08 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Brainscan
Occasional Poster

Posts: 19
Joined: 02/23/2010

I'm 24 years old and have been running a testosterone cycle since the beginning of December.

Within these last couple weeks in particular I have had noticable shedding, particularly a thinning around the crown area.

I am now seriously consider waning myself off of them.

I was curious if anyone had any insight as to whether bring my DHT levels back to normal will stop the shedding or if something has perhaps been triggered by such use??

I have some Xandrox on hand but am not ready to use it just yet.

Opinions are appreciated.

 

 02/23/2010 07:37 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Farrel
Moderator

Posts: 24150
Joined: 07/19/2000

It's really hard to say.   You could have caused MPB to start which might continue, or it might revert back.

Do you have a history of MPB in your family?

BTW I obviously don't recommend steroid use and I do recommend contacting an endocrinologist to discuss these issues with because you might need tests done to see where your hormone levels are at.



-------------------------
Disclaimer - I am not a physician or an expert and my advice should not be considered medical/expert advice. - If you follow my opinions and/or advice you do so at your own risk.
 02/23/2010 07:37 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Cappy
Regular Poster

Posts: 178
Joined: 09/26/2009

1. Is this your first cycle?
2. Hows the family history regarding hair loss?
3. Is it a Test only cycle?
4. Do you have the proper PCT?

For starters get some Nizoral going 3 x a week. Not really sure if Xandrox is effective at blocking the conversion but it may help regrow some of the lost hair. I would cautiously jump on Finasteride 1-1.25mg/day. Keep an eye for any signs of gyno and hopefully you already have Tamox on hand just in case.


Edit: Wow Farrel beat me with question 2 by a nano second :-)
 02/23/2010 07:44 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
J-Rod
Regular Poster

Posts: 125
Joined: 12/22/2009

Well if you lost hair because of using test, that means your hair folicals are sensitive to androgens. So stoping it will probable not stop your hairloss but it will happen slower than if you keep using it. You probably caused your hairloss to become active earlier in life.

You could look into finasteride. It helps with hair loss and in most people it actually raises testosterone.

Edit: Dang, ya'll both beat me.

 02/23/2010 11:51 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Brainscan
Occasional Poster

Posts: 19
Joined: 02/23/2010

Thanks for the replies everyone.

I believe I am prone to MPB though my grandparents, dad and uncles didn't lose their hair at this young of age.

I've been using Nizoral 2% shampoo every other day since beginning the cycle.  I also have both Finasteride and Xandrox 5% though if I have to use one I was leaning towards the Xandrox just because I have heard from a lot of people that Finasteride makes it tougher to lose stubborn body fat.

I do have Tamoxifen on hand if ever needed.

This is my first cycle, though I've been on testosterone replacement therapy under the administration of my endo (who I hardly ever see) since last spring.

For this reason I do not have any PCT planned.

It was a test cycle run with an A.I (Arimidex) as well as Anavar for the first first 6 weeks (though I always suspected the Anavar was fake).

 

A couple other things I've been wondering about..

In terms of hairloss would there be some benefit to slowly tapering down my test levels as opposed to just dropping back to the regular TRT altogether??

I’m aware that Arimidex in itself can raise testosterone levels, however aside from this does anyone know of any possible relation between the drug and hairloss??
I ask because I naturally have high-normal E2 levels and was thinking of staying on a tiny bit along with the TRT dose.

Thanks again.

 02/24/2010 02:22 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
stilldeciding
Accomplished Poster

Posts: 780
Joined: 08/01/2008

youve probably irreversably sped up your hair loss, by stopping steroids you could potentially curb it again, but either way you activated the bald gene, most likely earlier than otherwise.



-------------------------

AM
- S5 Spiro Cream 5% w/ 1% Caffeine and .025% Retin-A

PM
- Same as AM

- Peppermint Shampoo
- Fin .5mg (EOD) DROPPING
- Oral Spiro 75mg/day (goal:  150mg/day)
- Supplements

CONSIDERING
- Roxi .5%

 02/24/2010 02:45 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Cappy
Regular Poster

Posts: 178
Joined: 09/26/2009

To be honest with you I think its best that you visit your endo again. Be upfront regarding the Test/Anavar stack regardless if you think the Anvar is fake. Hopefully if he/she is knowledgable and understanding, you will receive alot more guidance than any of us can give you.

Good luck and keep us updated.
 03/05/2010 12:28 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Brainscan
Occasional Poster

Posts: 19
Joined: 02/23/2010

Sorry about the super slow response.

I shaved my hair to my usual #2 buzzcut today and noticed there is a balding spot in the crown area and I have diffusing over most of my head (though the back is the worst).  I knew things were bad beforehand but it wasn't until cutting my hair tonight (and being able to compare my buzzcut to how it usually looks) exactly how bad.

My situating seems to be a very complicated one.  Aside from the steroid use I have wildly fluctuating TSH levels, within the last year I have went from hyperthyroid to normal to hypothyroid to normal again.  I have been to walk-in clinic doctors who say that such wild fluctuation is very bizarre however they have no idea what the cause of this is.  The levels fluctuated quite a bit even when I wasn't on cycle.

Cappy, I didn't want to tell my endo the whole story but you are right, it's probably for the best.  My incompetent GP however keeps forgetting to send the referral to him so 10 days after my request I still don't have an appointment.  

Another problem here is the wait to see the endo is always at least a couple months, while at the moment I am absolutely desperate and am seriously considering Xandrox 5% (15% is now ordered as well).  In reality I need help now, yet none is available.

I have always seen the system here in Canada as slow and ineffective and this is just the type of situation it hurts me in the most.  

I suppose this may come off as shallow but looks have always been very important to me (my looks at least) and I'm finding this all very hard to deal with.  

For the last 5 or 6 days I have been tapering down the exogenous testosterone along with the Arimidex and am still losing hair.

I am absolutely devastated at the moment and I am now trying to decide exactly what to do next.

Again thanks for all the replies and I will keep this thread updated.

 03/05/2010 04:28 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
taste
Regular Poster

Posts: 118
Joined: 01/20/2008

Originally posted by: Farrel It's really hard to say.   You could have caused MPB to start which might continue, or it might revert back.

Do you have a history of MPB in your family?

BTW I obviously don't recommend steroid use and I do recommend contacting an endocrinologist to discuss these issues with because you might need tests done to see where your hormone levels are at.

I wasnt aware MPB is something that can be 'turned on' by activating the Male Pattern Gene? I guess Accutane would be similar, as there's alot of uses who blame it for starting hairloss.
 03/06/2010 09:04 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
4cryingoutloud
Prolific Poster

Posts: 211
Joined: 07/07/2009

Brainscan let me simplify it for you: If you want to save your hair, get on FIN now. Then take a breath and figure out all the details later and what coarse of action you should take for the future. Remember it is difficult to impossible to grow hair back lost to DHT damage, but easy to prevent hair loss with FIN. So the more you experiment and consult and guess the more your hair is maybe being lost forever.

You never told us what you T levels were. Do you really need all that T? And if you are trying to counter estrogen I would think there are other solutions. The more T you have, without FIN.'s 5ar inhibition, the more will be converted to DHT , and you will eventually get that old scruffy, balding, manly look as you age.

-------------------------
Propecia (Sept. 2008), Switched to 1.6mg FIN (Jan. 2010), Switched to 2.5mg FIN (Jan. 2011).
Nizoral shampoo
 03/06/2010 11:41 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Brainscan
Occasional Poster

Posts: 19
Joined: 02/23/2010


Testosterone levels came out as 1904 ng/ml and 2030 ng/ml while cycling.
It should be noted that my SHBG is also quite low (it always has been low-normal) so percentage wise my Free and Bioavailable T are higher and of course with it all that damn DHT.  This is a concern for me because even when I am in the normal testsoterone range my Free T will always be proportionately higher.  I’m just dying to see an endocrinolgist at the momet.

I always knew that I was taking a chance of course, however body image has been a thing of importance for me for a long time and in order to enhance my physique I was willing to take the gamble.

This last week I tapered down my testosterone dose to 300 mg/week and now I will be settling at around 150 mg./week, which should definitely put at least my Total T somewhere within normal range.

Aside from Arimidex increasing testosterone slightly is there any evidence that it’s really that bad on hairloss????


I have been looking for some studies on this particular topic for a while and any further elaboration would be greatly appreciated.
Are you aware of any other option which wouldn’t have a harmful effect??

As for the part about Finasteride, I was really just hoping to get a professional opinion as to what to do before committing myself to life on a drug, which I know has had some unpleasant side effects for some.  This is a very big decision.

As I said before I also have Xandrox 5% which I would be more keen to start using than Finasteride.  I will order the Xandrox 15% plus in a moment here.Perhaps I will start on the Xandrox 5% and then switch over to the 15 plus once it ges here.

Have you ever had any experience with Xandrox by any chance?

Anyways thanks for the post bro, it’s kind of unsettling to read though there is unfortunately a lot of truth there.

More opinions are appreciated as always!

 03/07/2010 05:03 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
SemperFi
Regular Poster

Posts: 160
Joined: 01/30/2010

Too bad you weren't warned about steroids' side effects before you started taking that s.hit. Hairloss and testicles shrinking/erectile disfunction are most widely present...

 03/07/2010 12:50 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Brainscan
Occasional Poster

Posts: 19
Joined: 02/23/2010

I was aware of potential side effects actually, I am quite obsessive about body image however and the idea of getting bigger/stronger was a very tempting one.
Erectile dysfunction and testes shrinking most often occur when PCT isn’t done properly and one can’t kickstart their HPTA axis, and get their boys working again.
This part wasn’t really of concern to me since I was diagnosed as hypogonad last spring, meaning I’m shut down as it is and was planning to be on endogenous testosterone (from Testosterone Replacement Therapy) for life anyways.

 03/07/2010 09:25 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
4cryingoutloud
Prolific Poster

Posts: 211
Joined: 07/07/2009

Xandrox 5% and Minoxidil solutions are for life too because if you quit, Minoxidil stimulated hair will fall out. It will grow hair that is able to do so but it does not prevent hair loss. Odd as it sounds, what hair will you be stimulating to grow if your hair is lost to DHT? You can still go balder while using Min but at first it will appear that it is working and you will be thicker and fuller but again without FIN protection you will continue to loose and eventually it will show. That is why the big three (Finasteride, Nizoral,Minoxidil) in unison is recommended. However you might grow thicker with FIN and Nizoral alone in a year and not need Min at all.

Serum T 241-827 ng/dl is normal range. Any time you up the T way above that, you risk triggering scalp hair loss, (MPB) , and increasing body hair in places you would never dream of, especially when you hit 35 -40. I had a friend in his late 20s that was into roids. He got huge but and then started losing hair. He thought he was improving his appearance but ironically he lost his youthful boyish body and appearance. Now he has a fatter face and fatter frame, and scruffy thinning hair, not what I would say an improvement at all cause now he just looks like his dad, LOL. To me, he just grew up way to fast overnight.

FIN raises T by the way, you probably knew that. My T is about 1200 ng/dl after being on FIN a year and a half and was flagged as high. My DHT is about 18 ng/dl. I weigh the same now as I did in college. Now I am in my 40s, Lifes good.

-------------------------
Propecia (Sept. 2008), Switched to 1.6mg FIN (Jan. 2010), Switched to 2.5mg FIN (Jan. 2011).
Nizoral shampoo
 03/07/2010 09:37 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
deano
Accomplished Poster

Posts: 1440
Joined: 08/15/2007

Originally posted by: J-Rod Well if you lost hair because of using test, that means your hair folicals are sensitive to androgens. So stoping it will probable not stop your hairloss but it will happen slower than if you keep using it. You probably caused your hairloss to become active earlier in life.

You could look into finasteride. It helps with hair loss and in most people it actually raises testosterone.

Edit: Dang, ya'll both beat me.

True, steroids don't cause hair loss, they speed it up in people who are susceptible to it. Another option can be to keep taking steroids and add Avodart, as Propecia is probably not powerful enough to stop and reverse hair loss in an environment like that.
 03/08/2010 12:32 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Brainscan
Occasional Poster

Posts: 19
Joined: 02/23/2010

Your post really got me thinking, 4cryingoutloud.

At this point I am sorry I cycled to begin with. Before losing any hair I had always been under the impression that hairloss would stop for most once testosterone and DHT levels were back to normal.  Perhaps I mentally downplayed such negative effects.

Yeah, I’m definitely aware that Xandrox and Minoxidil solutions are for life as well which is why I’ve been trying to just not jump on one thing.  At the same time I’m worried about the hair I’m losing by the day which may be gone forever.

I’m drawn to the idea of Xandrox because it combines Minoxidil with Azelaic Acid, which simply inhibits the DHT formation at the scalp as opposed to having a larger systemic effect.

I had heard of Finasteride slightly raising testosterone levels (as a results of it not being converted to DHT).  I have also heard a lot of stories of it becoming harder to cut bf% for individuals. 

It would make sense if this was because of the slight increase in testosterone (subsequently causing an increase in estrogen), though I am new to this and do not know if it’s the only explanation. Perhaps not enough research has been done on the whole and it is still very much speculation at this point???

I also ran across this bit about Finasteride on minoxidil.com which makes me slightly uneasy.

“There have been multiple reports of excessive shedding several months after finasteride therapy. Typically, there is a good response to finasteride to prevent or reverse MPB. Then, around the 11th to 16th week, there can be sudden shedding, sometimes on a massive scale. The entire phenomenon fits the description of a telogen effluvium. It is a common observation that post-partum women often suffer the same temporary hair loss. In the case of finasteride use, the telogen effluvium appears to be a reaction to the sudden change in the systemic levels of the sex hormone, DHT. Often the cause of a telogen effluvium are obscure, but has been related to high fevers, stress, trauma, medications, etc.”

While I have definitely been losing hair, specifically around the vertex/crown area I still don’t think my hair looks that bad.  It would be an absolute nightmare if Finasteride just made it permanently worse. 

That being said I am now off steroids and really want to halt any further loss.  Is there really this much risk in taking Finasteride??

I am definitely glad that Fin has worked out well for you.
I am still trying to decide if I should take the plunge or not.

 03/08/2010 06:49 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
SemperFi
Regular Poster

Posts: 160
Joined: 01/30/2010

Originally posted by: Brainscan I was aware of potential side effects actually, I am quite obsessive about body image however and the idea of getting bigger/stronger was a very tempting one. Erectile dysfunction and testes shrinking most often occur when PCT isn’t done properly and one can’t kickstart their HPTA axis, and get their boys working again. This part wasn’t really of concern to me since I was diagnosed as hypogonad last spring, meaning I’m shut down as it is and was planning to be on endogenous testosterone (from Testosterone Replacement Therapy) for life anyways.

I hope you at least have some competitive ambitions in body building or similar?

I don't want to judge you, but it seems you learned the hard way that the easy way can be much harder... :/

 03/08/2010 09:59 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Bryan
Accomplished Poster

Posts: 8410
Joined: 03/04/2001

Originally posted by: Brainscan

I'm drawn to the idea of Xandrox because it combines Minoxidil with Azelaic Acid, which simply inhibits the DHT formation at the scalp as opposed to having a larger systemic effect.


I have grave doubts that azelaic acid works as a topical 5a-reductase inhibitor. I certainly don't know of any scientific evidence that it does that; in fact, there's actually some evidence that it specifically does NOT do that: most studies show that topical azelaic acid has no effect on sebum production (which wouldn't be the expected result, if it were really able to suppress DHT).

Originally posted by: Brainscan

I had heard of Finasteride slightly raising testosterone levels (as a results of it not being converted to DHT).


I think I know what you're implying, and I believe it's wrong. I think there's an actual upregulation of testosterone production when you use finasteride, it's not just more testosterone hanging around because it's not being converted to DHT.

Edited: 03/08/2010 at 10:07 AM by Bryan
 03/08/2010 10:00 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
4cryingoutloud
Prolific Poster

Posts: 211
Joined: 07/07/2009

Why is there an up-regulation, another words what causes it?

-------------------------
Propecia (Sept. 2008), Switched to 1.6mg FIN (Jan. 2010), Switched to 2.5mg FIN (Jan. 2011).
Nizoral shampoo
 03/10/2010 09:27 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Brainscan
Occasional Poster

Posts: 19
Joined: 02/23/2010

Originally posted by: SemperFi
Originally posted by: Brainscan I was aware of potential side effects actually, I am quite obsessive about body image however and the idea of getting bigger/stronger was a very tempting one. Erectile dysfunction and testes shrinking most often occur when PCT isn’t done properly and one can’t kickstart their HPTA axis, and get their boys working again. This part wasn’t really of concern to me since I was diagnosed as hypogonad last spring, meaning I’m shut down as it is and was planning to be on endogenous testosterone (from Testosterone Replacement Therapy) for life anyways.

 

I hope you at least have some competitive ambitions in body building or similar? I don't want to judge you, but it seems you learned the hard way that the easy way can be much harder... :/

 

I’ve competed in a few smaller local lifting competitions for fun but that’s about it really.  Make no mistake, having a good physique through dieting/training has been VERY important to me for the last 6 or so years, and I’ve busted my ass off to get to where I am, however I simply don’t have the genetics to be a serious competitive bodybuilder.

Doing a bit more research I have indeed had a very hard time finding evidence that Azelaic Acic works as a topical 5AR inhibitor.
This is about the best I could come up with…
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3207614

This is unfortunate as I have heard too many stories about Finasteride leading to decreases in strength to be keen on taking it.
To update my situation, in addition to the Nizoral 2% I am now using Dr. Lee’s Xandrox 5% (which I already had on hand), twice a day, even though it’s probably just Minoxidil and not a DHT inhibitor in itself.
I also have some Minoxidil 6% plus headed my way which also contains 0.1% topical Finasteride.
I know that as of yet there is no real evidence that topical Finasteride really works but am willing to give it a shot just in case.

Sort of an afterthought, would taking 0.5 mg. of Finasteride a day as opposed to the usual 1mg. or more, inhibit one's serum DHT levels on a smaller scale??  Perhaps only half as much??

 

Hair Loss Help » Hair Loss Open Topic » Will stopping steroids stop hairloss??

1 2 3 4 5 Next Last unread
Topic Tools Topic Tools
Statistics
32105 users are registered to the Hair Loss Help forum.
There are currently 16 users logged in.
The most users ever online was 10152 on 02/16/2012 at 11:47 AM.
There are currently 553 guests browsing this forum, which makes a total of 569 users using this forum.

FuseTalk Basic Edition v3.2 - © 1999-2014 FuseTalk Inc. All rights reserved.

Copyright 2001-2012 - All Rights Reserved - Hairlosshelp, Inc