RC-

Thought i wud make our own thread, save jumpin btwn those other 2

However, i did leave you a couple of questions on those other threads

SO, Ive ordered my Prox-N and NANO Shampoo !!!

I got an email from betterlife about shippin and they replied 13 bucks ! Can you belive that ?
I cudnt order quick enough lol
But as it happened when i placed my order and marked UK as the country destination, it only chared me 5 bucks shippin !!!
lol
Maybe they will make an adjustment, but even still its still good value as some companys charge over 35 bucks to ship to the UK !

Ive also ordered my Phenytoin Caps
Delivery from inhouse is usually around 2 weeks as they are on some Tropical Island in the South Pacific lol

Ure prob get Prox-N before I get mine, just due to shippin times

Are you gonna wait until you have the Phenytoin Caps and kick off all together with Prox-N ?
Or you just gonna start with Prox-N when it arrives ?

Are you gonna take the excipients out of the Phenytoin Caps ?

Im deffo gonna try that water option Bryan spoke of

Also are you gonna keep the AA in the mix ? Any opinions on it havin a negative effect on any of the other active ingrediants ?

So, thats about it for now Im probably about 2 weeks away from day 1 and Im gonna stick with it for a minimum of 8-12 months and then review

I take photo's every month anyway to document my progress

I havent taken anythin away from my regime, just added the Prox-N and Phenytoin

Im gonna stick with Tricomin for now, but just once a day not twice

Cheers bud =)

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

Twister -

I think staying with Tricomin for once a day is not a bad idea. Perhaps you can phase it out later if you feel comfortable with the "poor man's proxiphen" (phen caps in minox, plus LEF Prox N from betterlife).

Hope you get your prox N soon. $5 shipping is not bad at all.

I'll start the Prox N as soon as I receive it. The only issue is that I am considering lasers, primarily to improve existing hair, and may incorporate those next month. I recently got active again on the boards and stared researching, and at this point, it seems like a no brainer to add prox N, phen caps, and at least try the lasers (since it's a one-time investment). The concern is, I may not know which treatment is responsible for any regrowth. So, I'll start with the Prox N. Perhaps delay getting on lasers. And I'll make a decision on the phenytoin when it arrives.

I'll try the water option with just one cap first. Will you be using distilled water?

I haven't thought about whether AA would interact with phenytoin. Perhaps I'll take out 10 ml of my "xandrox" and add 1 cap of phen to it and see whether any precipitate forms. If no precipitate forms, I'll feel comfortable adding the phen to the xandrox. If for some reason I lose ground 3 months from now, I would consider adding phen to the Prox N or making a separate phen topical. RC


-------------------------
32, Diffuse in MPB areas
Avodart (Dutasteride): 0.5 mg/day
Xandrox 5% (Minoxidil + Azelaic Acid): 2x/day
Spironolactone 5% cream: 2x/day
1% Keto shampoo EOD (Nizoral 2x/week, Revita 1x/week)

Considering:
NANO

Yeah I reckon its gonna take about 2 weeks via USPS, maybe 10 days if Im lucky lol
You shud ures in about 2-3 days !!!

As for lasers I think ure wise to wait, as like you said you wont know whats doin what if you start lasers as well as Prox-N with phenytoin

Do you think the phenytoin wud be better dumped into the Prox-N ?
Ive no idea if that wud be better than in the Minox, probably not much in it i wudnt of thought

Maybe one of the more experienced forum members cud offer an opinion if they have one ?

Yes I will use distilled water, but not sure 1 cap wud be enough as 100mg of residue at the bottom maybe hard to locate, idk

Im probably gonna do the full 6 then at least there is over half a gram to find if you see what i mean

What did you mean, "And I'll make a decision on the phenytoin when it arrives" It sounded like ure not sure if to use them, or did i misunderstand ?

Are you gonna apply ure Prox-N via ure minox ? Like mix it just before you apply ? How much Minox do you usually apply ?
Coz I know i apply more than 1ml at an application lol !

Cheers =)

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

Sorry I wasn't clear. I'll definitely be adding phen. Just not sure exactly when; it'll depend on when it arrives. And I also need to see whether I experience any tingling/inflammation etc. from prox-N. If not, and everything seems okay, I can add phen. If things seem off and I experience inflammation, I'll have to wait until things stabilize before adding phen. I'm not saying prox N is necessarily capable of inflammation; I'm just saying that I'll never know how my scalp will respond to a new treatment until I try it.

Might be better to dump the phen in prox N, if prox N has a higher PG content. I haev no idea about the PG content right now. Unless I learn more about it, I'll dump it in the minox. You're right; may be hard to remove the excipient with just one capsule.

I apply 1 ml of minox in the mornings, and ~1.5 ml at night. I'll probably get one of those small measuring cups (that come with cough syrups bottles), and dump 1 ml of minox in the cup, then add 8-10 drops of prox N in the cup. Then mix with the dropper and apply. Shouldn't add more than 1 minute to my regimen. Two advantages: The 8-10 drops of prox will be evenly spread over my MPB zones, and I don't have to deal with applying another topical to my scalp. Currently, I deal with 4 applications daily: Minox and spiro, 2x/each, every day. I don't want to increase that number. RC



-------------------------
32, Diffuse in MPB areas
Avodart (Dutasteride): 0.5 mg/day
Xandrox 5% (Minoxidil + Azelaic Acid): 2x/day
Spironolactone 5% cream: 2x/day
1% Keto shampoo EOD (Nizoral 2x/week, Revita 1x/week)

Considering:
NANO

RC

Mixing the two would dillute each treatment. Are you sure that's wise?

Also, can you say that Azelaic Acid has benefitted you more than standard minox?

I can't be sure that AA helped more than standard minox. I used to use crinagen, and then revivogen, with minox. I was doing better than on minox alone. Was this due to the AA in crin/rev? I don't know. But when I phased out crin and then rev, I wanted to maintain the AA in my regimen, and started Xandrox.

In regards to mixing the 2 - I'm not concerned about mixing prox N into the 1 ml of minox *just prior* to applying the 1 ml of minox. I wouldn't even try prox N unless i could apply it at the same time as minox because I'm not open to incorporating additional topicals daily. Also, prox rx already contains minox in it. I'll see where I stand at the 3 month mark after starting the minox+ prox N. (I've been applying a Piroctone Olamine solution into my minox *just prior* to applying the minox, and haven't noticed anything negative. But, I haven't noticed any benefit either.) RC

-------------------------
32, Diffuse in MPB areas
Avodart (Dutasteride): 0.5 mg/day
Xandrox 5% (Minoxidil + Azelaic Acid): 2x/day
Spironolactone 5% cream: 2x/day
1% Keto shampoo EOD (Nizoral 2x/week, Revita 1x/week)

Considering:
NANO

RC-

Do you plan to apply Prox-N at both Minox applications, or just ure evenin application ?

How do you get on with Spiro cream in ure hair in the mornin before work ?

It used to bother me, so i ended up just doin it at night, maybe i was applyin too much ?

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

Twister - Are you using spiro cream? If so, which brand? I didn't see it in your signature.

I apply less spiro in the morning, but I find it helps cover up the shine from minox at my hairline, so I like to use it in the morning. I also find that the cream keeps any alcohol-related inflammation in check from the minox applications. So I like to use spiro cream in conjunction with my minox topicals.

I think I will start prox N with only my evening application because it could minimize a shed. I like to introduce new treatments gradually. In the future, I might upgrade to twice daily. This will depend on how long the bottle lasts at 1x/daily, and how my scalp reacts to the Prox N. RC

-------------------------
32, Diffuse in MPB areas
Avodart (Dutasteride): 0.5 mg/day
Xandrox 5% (Minoxidil + Azelaic Acid): 2x/day
Spironolactone 5% cream: 2x/day
1% Keto shampoo EOD (Nizoral 2x/week, Revita 1x/week)

Considering:
NANO

I was usin Dr Lee's 5%

I think I gave up on it too soon

I plan to restart it though, with this updated regime

How long afrter ure minox app do you apply ure Spiro cream ?

I used to wait an hour, but i had no reference as to if that was right or wrong ?

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

How long did you use spiro for?

I believe Dr. Lee's site says that spiro can be applied right after minox, and it acts a as a dressing for the minox.

Here's an excerpt from one of my prior posts:

My regimen probably takes 15 minutes/day, at the most. I've gotten good at applying topicals quickly. I've been doing it since 1996!

Mornings, I apply Xandrox, wait a few minutes (but don't usually wait til it completely dries), then apply spiro, but not too much. 1/2 ml miox in crown/vertex, 1/2 ml on hairline/temples.

I pop a dut capsule on my way out the door (I've found taking dut at night interferes with my sleep)

At night, I do the same thing. Just before bed, apply xandrox. Might even put on 1.5 ml at night. I'lll wait a little longer than I would in the mornings; i'll floss and brush my teeth, then apply spiro liberally, followed by a few sprays of folligen.

I don't really make it a point to wait until xandrox has dried before putting on spiro, and i follow up at night right away with folligen after I put on spiro.


-------------------------
32, Diffuse in MPB areas
Avodart (Dutasteride): 0.5 mg/day
Xandrox 5% (Minoxidil + Azelaic Acid): 2x/day
Spironolactone 5% cream: 2x/day
1% Keto shampoo EOD (Nizoral 2x/week, Revita 1x/week)

Considering:
NANO

Ah i see

and it prob increases the Minox absorb too

I see you put folligen on after spiro ?
Does the cream not stop the absorbtion of the folligen ?
I wud of thought it wud create a barrier

As for my Tricomin i always apply before minox, say 30-60 minutes before...the UK site says 20 minutes but there you go lol

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

Twister - Perhaps the spiro creates a barrier for the folligen; I'm not sure. I don't use the folligen consistently, and only use it 3x/week or so. I haven't noticed anything from it, and it may be because I'm inconsistent with usage, because of the spiro barrier, a combination of both, or something else. The problem is, if I don't use folligen when applying my current topicals, I'll probably never end up using it. I suppose an option is to apply it well before my minox/spiro, but I'm not willing to engage in 3 topical sessions/day. Maybe I can apply it just prior to my minox. I'll probably end up dropping folligen once I finish the bottle, and once Prox-N arrives. RC


-------------------------
32, Diffuse in MPB areas
Avodart (Dutasteride): 0.5 mg/day
Xandrox 5% (Minoxidil + Azelaic Acid): 2x/day
Spironolactone 5% cream: 2x/day
1% Keto shampoo EOD (Nizoral 2x/week, Revita 1x/week)

Considering:
NANO

Edited: 04/20/2009 at 08:54 PM by RC

Ah ok dude

Ure deffo get ures before me lol !!

Did you order from betterlife ?

I hope my Phenytoin makes it through customs !!

Cheers =)



-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

Twister, RC - have you guys tried other topical anti-androgens besides Spiro? I think Fluridil adversely effected my hair, but would like to try something else. I also think Nizoral is way too harsh on my hair, any suggestions for an alternative shampoo?

-------------------------
Regimen:
- Xandrox 5%
- RU (Soon to Start)
- Considering Prox-N
- NANO Shampoo
- OTC Supps.

In a word no, unless you consider Azelaic Acid to be an AA

Ive only ever used Spiro

I was tempted to use Topical Flut, but was put off by the gyno stories

I did consider Fluridil, but decided against it due it bein so expensive and there were/are only 1 or 2 ppl on the forum that speak positive about it

As RC said, the Spiro cream is nice on the scalp for inflammation

Im just about to order some now from Dr Lee

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

Twister - I came across a few posts of people makig spiro cream with dermovan using "Bryan's method." I may consider this in the future to reduce monthly costs.

Yes; I ordered the prox N from betterlife. I suspect they'll be receiving numerous orders for Prox N this week due to our threads.

Twentysomething - Crinagen and Revivoge way back from 1999-2002, if you count them as AAs. I haven't tried any other topical AAs besides azelaic acid and spiro. I am not interested in Flut for the same reason Twister cited -- it may be absorbed. I also considered Lee's new minox with finasteride, but research on the boards indicates that it may be absorbed, and there is no evidence that it is not absorbed. Since I'm probably attaining significant DHT reduction with internal dut, I'd rather not chance absorption of any other AAs.

I consider shampooing with keto (or Niz) to be extremely important. If Nizoral is too harsh, consider Dandrene or Revita (both contain ~1% keto). If frequent use of keto is irritating your scalp, work in a piroctone olamine shampoo. Personally, I reap noticeable benefits from using a keto shampoo 3x/week, but not 1-2x/week. RC

-------------------------
32, Diffuse in MPB areas
Avodart (Dutasteride): 0.5 mg/day
Xandrox 5% (Minoxidil + Azelaic Acid): 2x/day
Spironolactone 5% cream: 2x/day
1% Keto shampoo EOD (Nizoral 2x/week, Revita 1x/week)

Considering:
NANO

RC

Just a head's up; they no longer make Dermovan.

Twister, why not just use prescription proxiphen?

RC

Yeah deffo up for makin a home made Spiro cream to save some money !!
Let me know if you have a plan !

Buyin AA saved me a bundle to make my own "Xandrox" !!

Hanger

Couple of reasons,

Its 100 bucks a month PLUS 25 bucks shippin

From what I read on posts made by Bryan and others, to make it last 1 month you need to only apply a very small amount on the tip of ure finger.... I know I wud fail with that and end up usin the stuff in like 2 weeks or so

Dr Lee's Spiro lasts me 2 months at 30 bucks a pop

The Phenytoin caps (200) ive ordered will last for 33 bottles of Minox

And finally Im not fussed about the Retin A not bein in the mix, as Im sure it will irritate my scalp

Soooo all things considered its,

Prox-N for 27 bucks- at 8-10 drops per day, it says 1-2 months supply

Minox- 9 bucks a bottle

Spiro- 15 bucks a month

Phenytoin- (6 caps) about 1 buck per bottle of Minox

So its around 39 bucks a month

As opposed to 125 bucks a month

I know all the ingrediants are not there, but for less than 40 bucks it close enough

Cheers =)

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral

Hanger

I meant to ask, do you manage to make it last a month ?

Does it come in a tube or a vial ?

I was readin that you need to apply 1/10th of a spoon, apparently thats the same as a very small amount on the tip of ure finger, how does that cover all the area that you need it to ?

Thats what i meant when i said i know i just wudnt make it last a full month

I wud appreciate you sharin ure experience with this product

Cheers dude =)

-------------------------
Spiro Cream 5%

Shampoo: NANO and Nizoral